Hes no longer timeless. Jimmy Akin: Ive learned so much. Myself as I said at the beginning, I find the Kalam argument quite helpful and understandable and I think in general persuasive because I do accept the premises and I understand that you can attack the premises, but I dont find the attacks as convincing as I find the premises themselves. I mean, I dont know if its still in the supply bin or what. Yes, absolutely. Is the developing fetus a human being? If you run that backwards as the Belgian priest Father Georges Lemaitre pointed out, originally our whole universe was in a hot, dense state. First, his delivery. I mean there are even some people exploring the idea before Islam arose. Word number two, syllogism. Of course, he could have used it. Dr. Craig: Yes, and that can only be a very positive development, I think. Venue: The Claremont Center for Reason, Religion, and Public Affairs. In the Council of Trent, it has a description of how justification takes place. Randal Rauser: Yes, definitely, and to recognize as well that there is always going to be a place for mystery. And if you cant in good conscience subscribe to the doctrine then I think you shouldnt be a Catholic. Yeah. Its not about him. {3} This would explain why some events (such as the Holocaust) are universally condemned by most conscientious people and even non-believers. Is this really proven? In your book, The Case for Life, and it was written primarily for Protestants, which is kind of why I wrote my book Persuasive Pro-life, I said, I wish there was a case for life that had a little bit of a Catholic flavor to it. The first premise is that everything that has a beginning has a cause. Jimmy Akin joins us and we gave him two simple tasksexplain the Kalam Cosmological Argument and tell us whether it proves that God exists. We can admit that there are differences in our traditions, and there are. But in popular Catholic piety, sometimes it seems that that line is crossed. Jimmy Akin: I think that in many cases practicing Catholics may not be much different than Protestants. It does have a cost associated with it, and your support is very, very welcome. William Lane Craig: I have benefited greatly from Catholic thinkers like Robert George, Patrick Lee, Hadley Arkes, Francis Beckwith, as well as benefiting from your own book, Trent. Jimmy Akin: Tell us a bit more about that. The third way is its unlimited in both. I'm your host, Catholic Answers apologist and speaker, Trent Horn. It also has one other advantage which is that its very easy to present to an audience. You can also look me up there if you want, but I agree totally, Trent. We have to stay focused on the main thing. I see tension in this quite often. In other words, its a victory that is won at the cost of real intellectual honesty because just as we would want other people to treat our views in their strongest form, so we should treat and respond to their views in their strongest form. So thats something they didnt have back in the 1200s when Aquinas In the 12th century or the 13th century when Aquinas and the other Medievals were writing. Lets say its that little like devilish person and people think, oh, Ive got to shut him up and not listen. There tends to be, in some Protestant circles more than Catholic circles, this idea that we shouldnt work with people of differing faiths. {5}. Kevin Harris: In Mexico, that kind of an image of a very rigorous, vigorous Mary exalted, arms outstretched, very much alive. The word Israel comes from the fact that Jacob was willing to wrestle with the angel through the night. Now, Aquinas is famous for his five ways of proving Gods existence. In regard to the latter, he mentioned a number of classical sixteenth-century concerns about certain Catholic doctrines, and in regard to the former, he said that he greatly admired the rich and. What I love is that your advice is perfect. I say, well, look, its prayer and practice and patience, but you need to have a particular approach. Mr. Klusendorf, would you say that abortions have always happened? Jimmy Akin: I have an Instagram page. William Lane Craig - Wikipedia These are individuals who have a commitment to truth, a commitment to holiness. Now, there are also arguments about do those models work or not and so forth. Jimmy Akin: Okay. When speaking about this topic, Craig fails to understand how Catholics can speak about the involvement of works in salvation, yet at the same time assert that we are justified by grace. He served as the Rector/President of Mundelein Seminary University of St. Mary of the Lake from 2012 until 2015. Jimmy Akin: Im so excited to talk with my guests today. What it means is when people want to respond to a position against their own view, and what they do is they respond to the weakest version of that objection and act as if thats a strong version of the objection. Theyve just tried to push it an infinite number of moments into the past. I craft these responses so that they are very brief, very pithy and can be quickly delivered because in a debate situation, time is so precious that youre battling the clock all that all the time. Okay, thats Craig in English. The reason I know this advice is because of him. that youve got a limit and you count minus one, minus two, minus three and you put a limit, well then its limited in both directions so its finite. Thats up to you, but because Aquinas was more influential than Bonaventure and other people were convinced by Aquinass criticisms of the argument, it didnt end up becoming a staple or popular argument in the history of Christendom. 94, at New Advent, at newadvent.org. Then if thats the case, he should be able to work with other people in order to save the children. You say that its inconsistent for the Protestant who wont work with a Catholic to save children from abortion. Weve got to keep the main thing, the main thing. Now, as you know, maybe our syllogism is mistaken. It seems that Buhrmann is arguing it is based on pleasant experiences, which would mean that the life of a menial laborer has no value. That was very distressing to Protestants as well who see Catholics as worshipping Mary, a human being. Christian superstar philosopher, theologian, and debater William Lane Craig has an opinion on almost anything, and these are almost always interesting. Trent Horn: Today were going to talk about four Protestant apologists who have helped to form me to be the apologist that I am today. I love the chapter in your book. Kalam is an Arabic word that means discourse-. If one cannot have those life experiences, they cannot be said to be living a valuable life. Dr. Craig: Yes, I think that is the bottom line really, Kevin. We dont need to pretend that there arent. Is this really not proven? My Four Protestant Role Models | Catholic Answers It does seem in practice many times a kind of Mary-olatry does occur. I have a Facebook page. However, if human intrinsic moral value is true, then this value must come from somewhere. Sometimes I think we do that because we actually want to avoid getting an answer, but other times, its out of sincere desire to really have a thing proven to us, to really have a certainty about a thing. What I said is that for a lot of Catholics, when you start to get into your faith and defend it, you see William Lane Craigs debates on YouTube and youre just blown away, and you think this is the greatest Christian apologist ever. To your mind then just as Jimmy Akin looking at this as an argument, an attempt to prove the existence of God, where do you assess it overall as far as its success? When somebody says to me, your book changed my life, your book led me to God, I always want to turn it back to God. That may be difficult to discern but I do think that that is the bottom line. The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy tells us that pleasure is affective positivity and good feelings. I think that it is a useful argument and I use it myself. Jimmy Akin: Otherwise if you just start out there its always going to be rough when you start. Well, they look us up at prolifetraining.com, prolifetraining.com, or they can go to our social media pages on Facebook. When he does debates, he is incredibly prepared. In the Middle Ages in Islam, there were a couple of schools of thought. In fact, Ill probably have them on the podcast hopefully soon to share our inside stories of what that was like. Kevin Harris: I see a lot more Bible reading among my Catholic friends, who have often complained that they were not encouraged to read the Bible perhaps growing up. We can acknowledge our theological distinctives, we can acknowledge we dont agree on key doctrinal issues, but we are committed to human beings being image bearers, and we have a duty to save image bearers from unjust killing. When did you write that, back in 1995? Whats the basic structure of the Kalam argument? The consequence of morality without a theistic foundation is not so much a different kind of morality as it is a lack of morality. The question is can you prove it by reason, and this is not something that has always been accepted. In fact, in debate, sometimes its best to put your bullet points up front, put your strongest, most succinct responses, right up front to clarify things, then explain yourself. I am not sure how Buhrmann would define these experiences. Youve assumed-. I want to say it was first published in 98, 1998. I think the scientific evidence is interesting and points in the direction of the universe having a beginning, but it cant be treated as conclusive. Heres a clip from his interview with Cameron Bertuzzi, where he gives advice on how to do debates. 1974; M.A. I praise God for how hes worked through William Lane Craigs life to bring me and other people into the kingdom of God. Andrew Buhrmann, Euthanasia and Intrinsic Value of Life, at Cal State East Bay (2008), at csueastbay.edu. Ive learned so much from him. So when it was reintroduced in the West, it became known by that name which is why its called the Kalam argument today. Then Im ready to speak from it. So ultimately I think if we are not going to be religious hypocrites, we have to ask ourselves, Can I in good conscience believe the things that in this case, the Catholic Church stands for? I find myself over and over again saying, Well, I cant really affirm that in good conscience.. Of course, the best argument for Gods existence is the one thats convincing, and this is indeed convincing to many, many people because God does exist and God loves us. Take care. Okay? So I guess lets start right from the beginning, Jimmy. Jimmy Akin: You dont have that option in debates as you full know. No, he made quite a number of points in response to the advocates of the Kalam argument, and as a result, the Kalam argument didnt really have a lot of advocates for a long time. That doesnt mean that its right. I appreciate it. The number one Protestant role model, unfortunately, could not be on the podcast today, but that is William Lane Craig. Word number one, syllogism. provides significant evidence in support of premises in philosophical arguments, for conclusions having theological significance. It doesnt prove everything about God, but it tries to prove that the universe has a creator, has a cause-. Absolutely. We are an army of part-time volunteers against a full-time army of individuals who are setting out to end these childrens lives. Theres no end there and so thats also infinite in a different direction. That argument seems flawed on a number of different levels. So the Kalam argument is one version of how you do that. The name Kalam comes from Medieval Islamic theology. Its a sign that the universe does not have an infinite history. Cy Kellett: Lecturing at Florida State, Dr. Craig gives seven reasons God exists and three reasons why it makes a difference. Does that mean that Aquinas believes that the other five ways are philosophically solid, that they are-. Catholics that Ive talk to that are clearly born again believers will readily say the Catholic Church needs to be evangelized. I think that premise is quite sound. As Thomas Edison said, I only see so far because I stand on the shoulders of giants. Also, it can be unlimited in the negative direction going into the past, minus one, minus two, minus three all the way to minus infinity. I think Dr. Craig, whats interesting, what makes him the most famous are not his written works, which are excellent, but its his debates. William Lane Craig's Two Questions:Part I - Substack I think sometimes that voice does raise some very significant things we have to consider, like Biblical violence, right? Collge Lonard de Vinci - Chtenay-Malabry, le-de-France - Foursquare What I appreciate about Greg is that he focuses not just on the what, not just on the answers, but something that Ive tried to really bring to Catholic apologetics in the past seven to 10 years that Ive been doing it, but the how. Nobodys ever asked me to do that. That is actually a sign of our devotion and piety or commitment to God and to his church, that were willing to wrestle with the hard questions. I see tension in this quite often. Tell us a little bit about the book and what does it mean to talk to our inner atheist? If not, then we want to try to help that person to make that commitment and move the knowledge from the head to the heart. It starts when youre first getting involved in apologetics. Nobody has ever said to me, you have to defend Catholic teaching against the reformation before we let you speak at this Catholic pro-life event. You have a new book out, and it really feeds into the theme Im talking about here about qualities I admire in other apologists, especially Protestant apologists. Once again, a big thanks to the Protestant theologians, apologists, and philosophers that have been on the show today, grateful for your work. Mm-hmm (affirmative). Hes artful, intelligent, incredibly polite, though he has an advantage in being polite because hes Canadian and its put into their DNA. I think when people watch his debates, when Catholics come to know William Lane Craig, they kind of go through a cycle with him. One that really moved me to become a pro-life apologist and engage heal, because people always say to me, Trent, how do you handle people on the radio about abortion?
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